Mortgage Broker Broadcast
Developing your knowledge to help you build a successful Mortgage Broker business. Craig Skelton shares his thoughts and experiences on all aspects of mortgage advice covering everything from operating in the banking world, estate agency based advisers all the way up to working as a self employed broker. He will be joined by experts from within the industry and other business sectors which all play a key part in becoming a successful mortgage broker in the modern world.
Mortgage Broker Broadcast
Building a Modern Broker Community: Conversations with Jonathan Needham
Feeling isolated as a mortgage broker? You're not alone. In this candid conversation, Craig Skelton welcomes back Jonathan Needham to explore the evolution of the Broker Foundry and address the unspoken challenges facing today's mortgage professionals.
The pair reflect on their recent "Foundations to Freedom" webinar and the overwhelming feedback from brokers hungry for unbiased industry guidance. What began as a live event is now transforming into something more accessible and impactful – a monthly conversation series designed to build a modern broker community without the barriers of registration or hidden agendas.
At the heart of their discussion lies a troubling reality: broker isolation. Whether you're a successful lone wolf operation or managing a growing team, the feeling of professional isolation affects brokers at every level. Existing communities often fail to provide truly neutral spaces where professionals can seek advice without encountering commercial motivations.
Craig and Jonathan dive deep into the concept of playing "devil's advocate" – offering perspectives that challenge thinking without steering brokers toward particular products or networks. This authentic dialogue represents something increasingly rare in an industry where advice typically comes with strings attached.
Against a backdrop of sweeping industry changes – AI integration, CMAP qualification updates, evolving FCA regulations, and a flood of new technology – brokers need straightforward guidance more than ever. The reimagined Broker Foundry aims to cut through the noise with practical insights delivered by two industry veterans who put their faces to their opinions.
Ready to break free from isolation and join a community built on transparency? Subscribe now and discover why this evolving platform might be exactly what you've been searching for as a mortgage professional navigating today's complex landscape
Looking for one to one mentoring, visit my website to see how it works craigskelton.co.uk
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Hi and welcome to this week's the Mortgage Broker broadcast. I'm your host, craig Skelton. I'm a mortgage business owner mentor and coach, and I'm here to help self-employed mortgage brokers and business owners build the business that they want. This is the podcast that's made for brokers at every single level, whether you're just starting out in the industry, you're running your own firm or you're looking to grow and scale your existing business. And today's episode I wanted to get Jonathan Needham back onto the podcast. Jonathan was on the podcast a few times recently. Back in May was the most recent one, talking about the Broker Foundry and the Foundations to Freedom webinar that Jonathan and I did back in the beginning of July. So what I wanted to do was getting back onto the podcast, talk a little bit about the webinar, talk about the Broke Foundry, where currently the Broke Foundry's at, but, more importantly, what does the future look like for the Broke Foundry? So let's just get Jonathan onto the podcast. So welcome back onto the podcast, jonathan. How are you? I'm very well, craig.
Speaker 2:Thank you very much. Recently back from my holiday, Nice.
Speaker 1:I thought we could see a bit of the bronzed look on your chops, yeah.
Speaker 2:Bit of a tan. I had a lovely couple of weeks over on roads in Greece, nice. I love it there, I really do, and it looks like I've brought the weather back with me.
Speaker 1:As they say, it certainly is. You have brought the weather back with you Everywhere you go, everywhere you go.
Speaker 2:You go, oh, somewhere, I can't remember. Crown.
Speaker 1:House, crown House. Yeah, that is my general answer. That's why this is sometimes this place.
Speaker 2:Because we've just been discussing. Looks like I've managed to get sign off for an office in my garden Nice so maybe the next time you have me on I'll be live from there. Who knows Rather than my kitchen.
Speaker 1:I thought you were just going to say I'll be with a trowel in my hand and a bit of and there's some in the background.
Speaker 2:I really wouldn't let me anywhere near the sort of the creation of anything really so absolutely hopeless when it comes to DIY. I can just about hang a picture. But yeah so, yeah, back at it. After a break, nicely refreshed, good, and thanks ever so much for having me on again.
Speaker 1:No, no, I appreciate you coming back on, mate, and it's been. I just thought it was good timing, given that we did. I just wanted to get a talk about, obviously, the webinar a little bit, just sort of see what's going on generally in terms of the mortgage broker space, in terms of what you're finding, but, more importantly, talk about the broker founders, talk about the webinar, talk about the feedback we had. What's sort of going on what the bit about what the future looks like as well with it, because I think, and yeah, so like what, and I cannot believe it was may you came on the, the podcast, the the webinar was what? Beginning of july, which podcast we're recording? Pretty late, we are recording this pretty I show noise. So we've got not a show of noise, that's not the right word, but we are. So we're all. We're sort of getting towards the end of augustth of August this comes out. So I can't believe it's sort of six weeks ago since the.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, neither can I really, and I think that's probably a reflection of the fast-paced nature of our world not that I don't think either of us would complain about that. The fast-paced nature of our worlds Not that I don't think either of us would complain about that. I always see, you know, I'm always grateful for having lots of things to keep me occupied and lots of people to speak to. And I think, going back to your point, as a consequence of us doing the Broker Foundry which I do still think was incredibly brave of us, you know, to do it live For two hours. You know, I think we should pat each other on the back for doing that, really, but whilst it was time well spent, uh, you found yourself on the back.
Speaker 2:I thought you were patting yourself on the back whilst it were time well spent, I and I know you did as well following conversations we've had. There's been more activity since, not necessarily just people tuning back in and listening, but the conversations, the separate conversations that you and I have had since. So I think, as an event, webinar, podcast, whatever you want to label it as as an event, it was a success, and you know you and I spoke prior and our motivation was well, look, if, at the end of the day, it helps one person, then that's been, you know, a job well done. One person, then that's been a job well done. I think we've both got enough evidence that would suggest it has, without question, helped more than one person. And I know one of the things we're going to talk about today is the potential continuation of us doing it, and I think we should, and I think we should. I genuinely think we should.
Speaker 1:Don't you? Yeah, definitely, without a shadow of a doubt. And I think the thing, like you said, the feedback we had fairly quickly after I'll take the bravery mate because, like you say, it was quite a unique. Well, I'll come to uniqueness in a second, because I just made a note there to talk about unique, but I think it was a unique. Well, I'll come to uniqueness in a second because I, like, just made a note there to talk about unique, but I think it was a unique setup in terms of somebody like you and I sat down for two hours talking about it. Was it unscripted? Absolutely, I think anybody that's was on the night or actually seen it, since I will sort of say that it was totally unscripted I don't think, I don't think we could do anything scripted mate, to be honest with you definitely.
Speaker 1:I think. I think you're right with that. But I think the thing with it is that, like after that, it was sort of, yes, we were I was mindful of one one which I know that you weren't so a bit of feedback there, one eye on the clock in terms of the timings and stuff like that, to make sure that we covered things. Quite a bit of feedback was. We could tell that it was a little bit rushed to the end and you felt as though you got more to give, which we had. Well, we always have, but I've certainly felt that, but I think it was certainly it's clearly seeing the appetite, for I think there's just so many changes in our industry that's going on. You've got to look at CMAP and the changes with the regulation with regards to the qualification and what that looks like. You've got the introduction of AI into the industry and looking at different things and a lot of work with the fc and how that's looking.
Speaker 1:There is some the movement right now, as a mortgage broker, if you've been doing this for quite some time, there are some changes. There are quite a bit of changes going on. If you're running a business, growing a business, owning a business, scaling it whatever, there's a lot of change going on. If you're a sole trader, a one-man band doing it and perfectly comfortable in that world, there is still change going on with how we've got to work within the industry. Don't get me wrong.
Speaker 1:This podcast is not about AI.
Speaker 1:I've done enough on that already.
Speaker 1:I think the way that AI is changing the world anyway, as brokers, there's a lot of questions going to be starting to ask and I think, in terms of you and I, with regards to our unique approach, shall we say, to how we communicate with each other uniqueness, how we communicate with people, that we work with people, the uniqueness that we we do communicate as business owners as well is is very unique.
Speaker 1:And I think that sort of that whole thing with the broker foundry and who's on the broker side and who's working for the broker and all the things and the things we talked about on the broker side and who's working for the broker and all the things we talked about on the webinar, about those kind of things where it's not opinions that are like a loaded kind of thing, and all those kind of things, and it is just two guys who have been in the industry for quite some time. We're still very forward thinking, we're still very much embracing the change in the world and the changes that we do. But I think that certain uniqueness where they're like for you and I and that's the feedback that I got personally was that it was just good to listen to somebody who has the experience, has the knowledge, but doesn't value. That doesn't sort of like put loadedness in terms of telling people what to do, but then also as well, it is just you and I having a chat about the mortgage industry.
Speaker 2:I think it comes back to what motivated us doing it, um, and, and I think again that that sort of motivation is what drives any conversation that a broker would have with whoever it might be. Let's say, uh, you know somebody currently in an employed role looking at transitioning to becoming a self-employed broker, uh, depending on who they're having the conversation with, uh will determine what that conversation looks and sounds like, and that, more often than not, is is driven by that individual's motivation, ie are they a recruiter within a network? So, therefore, their motivation will be to get a bum on a scene, whereas, going right back even before we came up with the concept of the broker foundry, going right back our motivation was simply to try and help people, and I know we sort of referenced that a couple of times, uh, on the night, um, and, and that that will always be our motivation. Now, as a consequence of that, if that then leads to further opportunities of working with people who engage with us, well that's great. But you know, if it doesn't, then that's. That's no hardship, because, um, the reason we're doing this is because we just want to almost lift the curtain, expose the truth a little bit, defrost the status quo, whatever saying you want to use and try and simplify what has and always probably will be a bit of a complex area for people to try and get their head around.
Speaker 2:And I think you're right. The landscape of the industry is changing. You know. Market shifts, pressures on brokers, they're being pulled in all different directions.
Speaker 2:I think the rise of tech should be embraced really, especially if it's going to make our roles more efficient. But then it's how is that going to fit in? There seems to be an absolute flood of different tools coming into the market. I get inundated, mainly through LinkedIn, from people wanting half an hour of my time to profile the latest piece of tech that's going to revolutionise their world, piece of tech that's going to revolutionize their world. So I can imagine that, if you're in a different position to us, if you're right at the start of your journey, it must be more daunting than ever really. And, as we've said, the role of the foundry the broker foundry was to just provide some very straightforward, very, very honest advice, opinions, feedback, whatever you might want to call it that isn't motivated by anything other than we just want to try and help. So, yeah, I think the feedback that we've had, I think it's something we should probably do again. I'm not entirely sure whether we do it for two hours.
Speaker 1:In all honesty, I think we should definitely get me a big stopwatch, or you just Big clock on your new office wall. Mate, that's what I'm going to have a big clock on you or you just cut me off.
Speaker 2:But yeah, there is an appetite out there, without any question, from people who and it does surprise me really that want to listen to a couple of lads from South Yorkshire. So I mean going back to your point regarding the timings, and I do accept that there was an opportunity for us to provide more than we gave, but, appreciating that probably there were more people that tuned in to the recording afterwards, do we just pre-record it live rather than doing a live event?
Speaker 1:to be honest with you, it's a real good point, because I just made a note there in terms of I was just thinking, like to be fair, I was thinking exactly the same thing, because I was thinking when we talked to them about the idea is to support people, is to give them that help. There is no sort of loaded opinions that we're giving. It is just around that. There's no sales pitch with it. Obviously, everyone knows that there's different avenues and different things, that we can help people become brokers or set the business up and all those kind of things. There is that.
Speaker 1:So what I was thinking I just wrote down down there just when you were sort of talking is that, was it because we did like the? You had to email events at the broker, foundercom, to get your ticket, to get the link to get that what? And did people feel actually, oh well, I'm going to get inundated from email campaigns and email marketing, I have to unsubscribe. They'm going to get inundated from email campaigns and email marketing, I have to unsubscribe. They're going to be pitching me something, I'm going to be selling something.
Speaker 1:Do we then just like say I'm glad you said that, because that's exactly where my thought was going. Do we take that lid off it really and just go? Do you know what? Let's just record it, put it out there for everybody. There's no you've got to email this or you've got that, and we'll set up a the broker foundry where a one place where people can get all the recordings, get get that there and it is just then out there, readily available for everybody who's looking for help yeah, I think, I think that's a decent shout and I think, going back when we first started talking about doing an event, if you remember that, we were talking about doing it in person.
Speaker 2:You know, hiring a venue somewhere central one evening and get it, and then that kind of developed into, well, you know, how would people turn up in person and remain anonymous, and so and I suppose the fact that we did it as a live webinar, there was an opportunity for it to look and feel a little bit different. Uh, you know, it was unique, um, and I'm glad we did it, genuinely I'm glad we did it. But you know, for every person that tuned in on the evening, there was another person saying, oh well, I can't make uh, tuesday at six or whatever day it was on, and, yeah, it did probably feel a little bit like Fort Knox trying to get into it. So, no, I think, yeah, maybe we're on to something there. Maybe the next session that we do, you and I can just well, we can record it whenever we would need to, as we're doing with this uh, and then just, you know, make sure everybody's aware as to when it, when it's going to go out.
Speaker 2:The other benefit, of course, is if that's something that we're seriously going to commit to doing I don't know say once a month, or however frequently we do it. We can invite suggestions in as to different topics. We could even have guests from lenders or insurance providers or whoever it might be some of these tech firms, providers or whoever it might be some of these tech firms. So no, I think there's definite mileage there, mate, seriously, and you know, let's not forget, it will undoubtedly take the pressure off us a little bit, you know, especially given my need for visiting the toilet on a fairly regular basis, as I did and left you holding the fort.
Speaker 1:That's not my motivation, mate, to be fair, let me just get that clear. Your toilet activities is not my Let the cow out back day. If people haven't listened to it, I'll watch that, uh, the webinar. But I think, and I think as well, what one thing that can frustrate me from time to time is that I think monthly. I think if we do it, if we did something that's monthly, it then um, obviously we can then make sure we're in time in terms of like the stuff. I think an hour is long enough in terms of for people to to listen to to you and I, and if they want it in half an hour, then they can double the speed, or 45 minutes, then they can do it on their time and off, or whatever the case may be. But I think as well, I think we sort of say that like.
Speaker 1:So, going back to what frustrates me is that I have certain podcasts that I listen to and I'm more stricter with the ones that come out at the same time every week, every month, whenever that is, and I'm I get notifications and then it's like okay, I know I can do that now I like I'll some I run to, so some like ones weekly that I'll run for like listen to that podcast for an hour and then I'll run while I'm doing like that or whatever the case should be. It's. Then I think if we sort of say it's once a month, it comes out first of the month in terms like saying, right, it's out on the first of the month, start your month, we'll give you like, and then we can use sort of bits of stuff in terms of motivation and reviewing the month and all the like, the other stuff that we sort of we look at as well. I think, if we sort of say, first of the month, we're there, we're releasing an episode I'm not going to a webinar and we release a something, I don't think it really matters.
Speaker 1:Does it what we call it really?
Speaker 2:I think, yeah, I agree. I think, again going back to our original sort of conversations about this, we're all about trying to build more of a modern broker community. And how do we do that? What platform do we do it on? I'm not entirely sure, but there's definitely a conversation or conversations to be had.
Speaker 2:I don't think we would struggle for topics. You know, if we were doing it once a month there's 12 sessions there or 12 episodes I genuinely don't think we'd have things to. You know, we wouldn't run out of things to talk about. No, definitely not. I genuinely think, within sort of self-employed advisors, brokers, wherever we're going to refer to them, as there's perhaps a bit of an isolation problem, that they are on their own and you know, yes, they might be part of a network, but sort of that feeling of being isolated. Where do I go to for support on different things? So it kind of takes that speak to a lot of brokers who perhaps do feel like they're stranded on an island, not just about checking into them regarding the performance and the productivity, but the well-being, how they're feeling, and then it's the more practical support that I think we can provide them with, not just pep talks, but real, practical support what does good look like, what works, you know, sharing of best practice, that sort of thing.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, maybe doing it in that format would would also allow us the opportunity of building this, uh, modern broker community a little bit more under the sort of the banner of, you know, the broker boundary uh so so now I'd I'd definitely be be up for that definitely and I think if we do do go down the route of something like youtube channel I've obviously got youtube channel set up already because the broke foundry but if we went down that chat down there, people can leave the comments on there, people can leave the thoughts on there, people can leave any sort of thing, sort of what for guests or topics, I think, like you say, in terms of suggestions, and I think that will sort of work massively. And I think, to be fair, mate, it's quite strange sometimes how our brains are aligned, because I wrote down earlier two. Well, I wrote three words. One is one word, the other is two words, but the first one was isolation. I'll only say I wrote that down.
Speaker 1:Yeah, about to talk about isolation on the podcast.
Speaker 1:I know that I know the podcast gone a bit of a different and we can talk about isolation on the broke foundry, absolutely, but I think that's a big thing is isolation is a big thing for broke and in fact it doesn't really matter where, even if you're at the top of the, there's quite a few business owners that I know that they are, that they've got a business, they've got two or three brokers work, they're working with, but they're there's only them at the top, there's only them. They're not in a partnership, they're doing the decisions that they're recruiting that they hate. So again, they isolated. So we can sort of talk about those things. And so that was one word that I wrote down, and then the other one which I found comes up so much recently in conversations I'm having, which is in fact two words, which is devil's advocate. So I think, given that you didn't know what I was going to say there, did you I bet you didn't think I was going said Dale is an advocate, did you? No, no.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:So that comes up quite a bit in terms of conversations I'm having, because and it goes back to the loaded answers and being told what to do by people that benefits them. So the feedback that I've got, I've had about the webinar and about the reaching out after, was that they felt that they could reach out to you and I and we would play devil's advocate for them and I I know what devil's advocate what is. I just I did a bit of research and I'm not going to share on the podcast but I thought actually, where does devil's advocate come from?
Speaker 2:catholic saying not religious I thought what I thought. It was a film with Keanu Reeves and Al Pacino. It is. I think it is actually. You'll have to have a look at that Good film. Apparently Al Pacino's the devil, but anyway.
Speaker 1:Well, I think the original version goes back to 15-something or other and it's from the Catholic Church. If you want bored bored, then uh, yeah, but devil's. But I think, getting back on point, and I can see where our broker founder is going to, conversations are going to go. Um, going back, like, my point was that I think it just is having that and the feedback was I get back to I don't know what I was saying now that they felt that they could reach out to you and I and we would give them be able to play devil's advocate and just give them the, the ask the right question, give the right product, not just go along with oh yeah, you need to be doing that because it benefits me in any way. It's actually start. It's asking the questions that maybe not get, get asked, and then just being able to discuss that through with somebody who's looking to get in the industry or looking to change what they're currently doing in the industry, but getting the advice from somebody who has done it before.
Speaker 2:Yeah, done it before, got the experience, and it doesn't really make a great deal of difference to them, to the fact that they're just going to tell it as it is. This is a totally unencumbered opinion that I'm going to give you, which is for your benefit entirely. What you do with that information is up to you. And yeah, I get that, because sometimes you think you think, oh well, if I ask that person the question, they're going to give me a version that they want to give, as opposed to, you know, just just total open and openness and honesty.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, and no, I'm going back to the isolation thing again, something that I've had a couple of conversations with, with different people and, uh, you know, they might class themselves as as lone wolves. Uh, you know, one, one person, operations, of which there's there's an awful lot in the industry, uh, very, very successful operations, uh, but they feel quite isolated and they desperately want to be part of some kind of community, some kind of collaboration, and don't really know where to go. I know there's multiple different groups within Facebook, but that, I think I don't know. It just looks and feels a little bit faceless to me, whereas there's definitely an opportunity for something to exist.
Speaker 1:That feels like it's real life yeah, yeah, in my opinion, definitely, and I think, like, yeah, I have my own opinions on those facebook groups in terms of, um, their motivation, uh, and a few other things as well, which, um, yeah, and there's certain ones have the benefits. Absolutely, it's giving them that feeling like the broker's got that bit of community, but then you can, um, it can be led in a different way, shall we say, than what the purpose of actually is, about building a community for the brokers.
Speaker 2:And I think the difference is clear whether this is a good or a bad thing, but we actually put our faces to this. You know, this is real life. This is real, whereas perhaps sometimes Facebook isn't. It's sort of hidden behind whatever, whereas we're lifting the curtain on this and allowing everybody to see that the wizard is just a bloke with a microphone. So it's just an illusion which, to be honest with you, the majority of things are aren't they, yeah, they are Absolutely.
Speaker 1:I can say, yeah, it's not part of the world anyway.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. I think there's nothing wrong with booking that trend mate and just thinking about it, and that's the good thing about it. We can sort of see then what's not, what we understand, what we're, what we do and how we help people in the support and stuff like that. And without the sort of the um, the, the biased, and I think that's sort of then with the facebook groups is, then we can sort of see that and brokers can see that as well. I've seen, I do know, brokers that have been thrown off the um, the facebook groups, just for calling out the bias, shall we say, and then all of a sudden, so it's not. Is it really truly the brokers at heart? And I think there is that certainly a need for some safe space where people can just feel as though they can reach out, and how that looks. This will forever evolve, won't it?
Speaker 2:It'll evolve. Yeah, yeah, it will evolve. I think if you're providing opinions on certain things verbally, it's easier to provide a context than it is if it's just written down, you know. So I think there's a value there, definitely. But no, I think we should do it. We might end up with a sponsor. You never know.
Speaker 1:Who knows, who knows York Tea.
Speaker 2:Or Starbucks. That'd be good. I'm having to pay £4 for a flat white these days, so let's get some sponsorship coming in yeah, we could.
Speaker 1:I think that's not a bad idea getting some sponsorship. I'm not like.
Speaker 2:British Steel. I don't think British Steel exists anymore. No, no, I don't think it does?
Speaker 1:I think Sheffield Steel still does exist in some sort. I went somewhere recently miles away and then for some random reason saw the cutlery and it had Sheffield on it. I thought, wow, that has travelled well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't think I'll go to my football club for sponsorship mate.
Speaker 1:So I don't think they've, I don't think we should, I don't think we should.
Speaker 2:I weren't going to bring Sheffield Wednesday up, craig, so we'd probably need another half an hour. I'm an Inter-Overham United supporter. It's not that I'm revelling in Wednesday's current problems, but no, I'm fairly confident that you'll get sorted. I think Simon Jordan's put himself in frame.
Speaker 1:I think he's doing the. What's the? Is it the okie-cokie? You put your left leg in your left leg. Out, out, out out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, shake it all about.
Speaker 1:To defend that. I knew that. That just came into my. I'm a bit worried that that actually just came into my brain at that moment. So, jonathan, I think, like thanks for coming. I think that, yeah, I think that's sort of like absolutely perfect. I think that's sort of not quite what I had when I thought I'd get you back on the podcast to talk about it, but to talk about the Broke Foundry. However, I think, from coming back on the podcast, I think it's been good to share with everybody what, what went on, the reasons why not, which people knew already, but and the and the sort of feedback after. But actually I was quite alive of how that evolved in terms of thinking do you know what? Let's make it open to all. Let's not make it guarded. Let's make it. It is all about the broker.
Speaker 2:At the end of the day, I was genuinely open or hoping, sorry, I was genuinely hoping that there'd be an opportunity for us to pick up the broker foundry and I was looking forward to doing us to do another event. I think this, this conversation, has been incredibly useful in that with we've been to, you know, sort of come up with an idea whereby it will exist in a slightly different format, and I think that will be to everybody's benefit, powers and the people that are going to listen to it. Definitely. So I'll see you on the next Broker Foundry.
Speaker 1:You will, you will. Jonathan, thank you so much for your time, thank you for being on and it's been great to catch up. And, yeah, I'm not going to say we're going to see you on the other side on the Broker Foundry. Yeah, all the best, mate, thanks a lot. Thanks a lot, jonathan.
Speaker 1:Thanks for agreeing to come back onto the podcast and talking about the webinar and, really, more importantly, what the Broker Foundry looks like now moving forward, which looks like it's going to be more of a YouTube channel, podcast-based than the webinars, which just means it's going to be free and easy to access for everybody concerned and easier for Jonathan and I to record as well, which is important. So, yeah, and if you found today's episode useful, as always, please don't forget to follow the podcast, leave a review, share it with somebody in your mortgage broker network that needs to hear the messages that Jonathan and I are talking about. And if you are thinking about becoming a self-employed mortgage broker or looking to set up your own brand of business, or you're looking to grow and scale your existing business, see my website, craigskeltoncouk, or just send mea message and let's have a chat about how I can help you achieve your goals for the rest of 2025 and, as always, please don't forget to run your own race.