Mortgage Broker Broadcast
Developing your knowledge to help you build a successful Mortgage Broker business. Craig Skelton shares his thoughts and experiences on all aspects of mortgage advice covering everything from operating in the banking world, estate agency based advisers all the way up to working as a self employed broker. He will be joined by experts from within the industry and other business sectors which all play a key part in becoming a successful mortgage broker in the modern world.
Mortgage Broker Broadcast
Securing Your Legacy: How Will Writing Transforms Client Protection
Securing your clients' futures doesn't stop at arranging their mortgage and protection. Estate planning remains one of the most overlooked yet crucial components of financial wellbeing, with over 80% of people under 50 lacking a will. This missing piece creates vulnerability not only for clients but for your broker-client relationship.
Colin Gill, founder of The Will Place, shares his journey from corporate financial services to creating a platform that transforms how brokers approach estate planning. Drawing from his 11 years at Connells and subsequent entrepreneurial ventures, Colin identified a critical gap in how mortgage professionals address will writing – often recognizing the need but lacking a streamlined solution to offer clients.
The conversation reveals how will fact-finds expose clients' entire financial situations – including details about mortgages, protection, pensions, and investments – making them particularly vulnerable to poaching when seeking estate planning elsewhere. By integrating will writing into their proposition, brokers not only protect these relationships but uncover significant business opportunities that might otherwise be missed.
What sets The Will Place apart is its dual focus on client experience and broker business generation. The platform identifies protection gaps and financial planning needs during the will creation process, then directs these opportunities back to the originating broker. Even more valuable is the executor and guardian notification system that creates new qualified introductions from a client's close connections – people you might never otherwise meet.
Whether you're a newly self-employed broker looking to differentiate your proposition or an established business seeking to enhance client retention, this episode provides practical insights into transforming a traditional pain point into a powerful business advantage. The future of mortgage advice isn't just about finding the right mortgage – it's about protecting client relationships by addressing their complete financial journey.
Looking for one to one mentoring, visit my website to see how it works craigskelton.co.uk
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Hi and welcome to this week's the Mortgage Broker broadcast. I'm your host, craig Skelton. I'm a mortgage business owner mentor and coach, and I'm here to help self-employed mortgage brokers and business owners build the business that they want. This podcast is made for brokers at every single level, whether you're just starting out in the industry or you're running your own firm, or you're looking to scale and grow your existing business. And before we get into today's episode, I just want to remind you about the Foundations to Freedom webinar, the webinar that Jonathan Edom and I host. The next one is on Wednesday, the 4th of September. So if you're thinking about becoming a self-employed mortgage broker or you're already early in that journey, then this is a free webinar where we give you honest advice, give you honest insight, tips from people that have already done it and what the pitfalls to watch out for. So if you're interested in registering for that, if you email events at thebrokerfoundrycom and we will send you a link to that webinar. So now into today's podcast.
Speaker 1:My guest this week is Colin Gill from the World Place. I wanted to get Colin onto the podcast to talk a bit about his background in terms of his journey in financial services but, more importantly, talk about the World Place, what it's doing, why it's set up, how it benefits brokers, how it benefits clients and helps brokers enhance their proposition and helps them spot opportunities as well that they may have missed. So, yeah, let's just get Colin onto the podcast. So welcome onto the podcast, colin. How are you? I'm great, thanks, how are you? Yeah, very good, thank you very good. Very good and first podcast. I understand this is the first podcast you've been invited the first well, the first time through the wheel place.
Speaker 2:Uh, I've done one podcast before through in another company, but it was very rehearsed, very practiced.
Speaker 1:So we'll class it as the first one in your current guise in terms of the world. Absolutely, yeah, so perfect. So hopefully it won't be too painful for you. In terms of the podcast, and thank you for agreeing to come on. I'm looking forward to it. We've had a bit of chat before, but I'm just looking. We have a chat about past and our sort of uh pasted intertwine a little bit um in the past, but then more about what you're doing now and why and how it benefits brokers and clients as well, obviously, because they're just as important. So, but for those people that don't know who you are, do you want to just sort of give a quick introduction without too many spoilers yeah, so I'm colin gill.
Speaker 2:Currently I I own and run the will place uh, which is a platform purposely designed for mortgage brokers, ifas anyone in financial space, to use with their clients who want to offer a really good and efficient will writing service perfect.
Speaker 1:That was really good brief introduction. I'm like people normally start going like going into in depth and they go, no, no, we need to be talking about this on the podcast, so no, that's well.
Speaker 2:So thanks, almost like I demo this every day.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, well, in terms of so, do you just? Um, we're going to get onto the world place and get in depth in that. Do you want to just give us a past in financial services? Cause you started out building society world quite a few. Even though you don't look old enough, you've been sort of quite a while.
Speaker 2:So my my first job in financial services was with Barclays. So I I worked in a call center in Doxford Park in Sunderland and I was atrocious, like I was so bad at the job. It was a outbound calling, so you get a beep in your ear and then the name on the screen and, um, I was. It was in the world before customer service, so it was sell, sell, sell. So my job was to get people who had personal loans to take out more personal loans. And I was so bad it's so cringe and I ended up actually crashing my car and I couldn't get to work anymore, so I had to get a different job. Um, so I ended up working at leeds building society, on the counter with the passbooks, paying in their cash and basically doing everything.
Speaker 2:I think anyone who's worked for a small building society before attests that you start off doing that. But you, the longer you stay, you just get more responsibility. You don't stop doing the original job because you everyone ends up doing the same role. You cover each other because there's only normally four or five of you in each branch. Um, so I worked for leads for um four, four and a half years. Um, I did my mortgage qualifications with them. I was a branch manager with them, worked in different offices, and then I relocated back to Bedford because I studied in London. So I currently live in Newcastle, relocated back to Bedford and I wanted a different job because I was commuting to London. If you imagine a six foot four frame sat on a tiny 50cc scooter, it's not aerodynamic at all. That's how I was travelling to the train station.
Speaker 2:So I thought I thought best get another job. And someone suggested being a mortgage broker in an estate agent would be a good idea. And so I just started applying for some jobs and um ended up getting a job for a company called connells and from the northeast. I'd never heard of connells, I had no idea the size of the brand, and then you could argue I'd really put interview prep because I still didn't know the size of the brand when I went there. And I stayed there for 11 years doing various different roles.
Speaker 2:So I originally worked in that Stoney Stratford office in Milton Keynes, right, and yes, I think corporate estate agency life obviously's lots of negatives and we all understand what those are, but I think there's also a lot of positives that you can learn from that role too.
Speaker 2:You know, working closely with an estate agent I know you've got a similar background to a degree I think you get a good understanding of just what goes into the role of an estate agent, more of an appreciation of the job they have to do, and you certainly get a high appreciation for appointments, especially considering because quite a lot of the appointments that I would see on a regular basis would be people who didn't necessarily want to see me to begin with and might have been convinced that it's a good idea to get a second opinion and just to speak to me off that. So yeah, it's not very rare would somebody call up the office and say like I have an appointment, please. They would always be sold. I don't know if you had a similar experience, but when I was a state agent mortgage broker, I don't think I I had many appointments that contacted the office to say I'd like to speak to a mortgage consultant, please.
Speaker 1:No, very right and I think you brushed very well on bypass the whole conditional sell-in there. Colin, I think you sort of like did that very, very well. That was that's worth that one. Yeah, you did very well with that in that quick topic yeah, yeah, it's, uh, it's, it's there, isn't it?
Speaker 2:you can't, you can't, argue against it. Um, I haven't been that um, vocal on it online, um, and I've purposefully stayed away from that because I'd feel a little hypocritical, because to say that I didn't go close to the line when I was in that role I'd be, I'd be, I'd be lying, to be honest, that I was put into those positions and put pressure to get targets, um, and convince people to do mortgages with me. Now. I, as a mortgage broker, I did the best job that I could to place that mortgage and they always got the best deal that I could get for them. I feel that I give them a great service.
Speaker 2:But, moving away from it and I suppose seeing it from the outside in, and especially seeing it as much as it's commented on, it's not just Connells that do this. There's lots of different estate agencies. It's just they're the biggest target that do this. It's there's lots of different estate agencies, it's just they're the biggest target. You know they're. They have the the largest amount of agents, um, largest amounts of mortgage brokers in there. So they're going to be, they're going to come up more and more often than the others who who also do it too I think that it's a good point because I think that's what something that is missed a little bit.
Speaker 1:We we both mutually share that employer. In the past you spent over 10 years there, so 11 years there, so that was sort of good grounding for you, shall we say. I think that is something that is missed a little bit. Obviously, connells is the target because it's the largest and it's sort of taken over the likes obviously, and the brands it has within that, and I think that's what you, what the, the. It misses slightly is that there are.
Speaker 1:You sort of hit the nail on the head there with what you said a little bit back before, that, coming from a corporate world, you are taught a lot of things, you learn a lot of things in there. You've got the good things, you, that you bring from the corporate world. You are taught a lot of things, you learn a lot of things in there. You've got the good things that you bring from the corporate world and then you leave the bad things in that corporate world. So that's the benefit of working for a corporate and then coming away from that, and I think we talk about mortgage brokers leaving the corporate world. What we seem to miss is actually there's estate agents out there that are from the corporate world that are being brought up in the world of.
Speaker 1:Like I was based in Yorkshire with Connells. Would I ever see conditional selling? No, I wouldn't. I've never actually seen and I managed it. I was a broker. I managed a team. Big teams are broken. We would never talk about. It was never seen as a conditional saying you have to. This's something you have to do, obviously when it sells environment. So we're there to persuade clients to, to, to, to get in to see the mortgage broker.
Speaker 1:But I think that where I sit missed the mark a little bit is because, like you said, there's then and like I was making my point is that there's estate agents that have come from the corporate world, understand how much mortgage services, the income that that brings to that business yeah, and then are still doing that the same thing, whether they're working for an online agent or another brand or their own brand.
Speaker 1:I I know agents that have set up themselves and still work in that way, work and have a broker themselves that they work with and they are still doing that. So it's not just connells, I think it's just obviously the biggest target. I think the whole world of estate agency. There are really good estate agents that don't do the conditional selling and the the sort of the arm behind the client's back, and this is what they have to do to buy this house or view it. However, there are other people that are hiding behind the comments and hiding behind the covers, going you know what I do that, but luckily I'm a small target so they're never going to worry about me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you make a really good point in the fact that mortgage services is an ancillary service within a state agency. Um, so it's. It is a business at the end of the day and obviously, um, you need to look after your clients because without doing that, you're not going to get repeat business, unless, obviously, you're a massive corporate giant and maybe that's not your number one concern. Who knows, I don't want to get into that. But if you're a small business, then looking at different revenue streams is just going to be sensible. Any business will do that and it's making sure that, I suppose, the behaviors that you use are appropriate for the environment and you're not, I suppose, forcing somebody to do something by dangling a carrot in front of them, that you can learn from being in a corporate world and take it away.
Speaker 2:But I think one of the things I've always found really interesting about my time at Connells was how they're so good at creating this bubble of don't go somewhere else because you won't make it. It won't be better to stay here? This is, this is where this is where it's good, this is where you'll earn your money, this is where you'll get your career, and I think because so many people join connells as trainees and they get a lot of people who've who stayed there thinking that that's absolutely right. I mean myself included. I stayed there for 11 years, not not because of fear of going somewhere else, but but I thrived in a reward-based environment. So I hit my targets, I got rewarded, you know, I did better at my job than I got promoted, you know, and I think I responded to that, so I advanced my career and that's why I decided to stay there. But they're very good at creating a bubble of um of safety, I suppose. Yeah, I imagine it's probably not different to any other corporate company.
Speaker 1:You know find it quite interesting no, definitely, I think, like you, absolutely. I said they've got that. They have that mentality of that. You, that you, they put that element of doubt. And if you're a broker going from, and we'll come on to like what what you do right now. But if you're a broker going from and we'll come on to like what what you do right now, but if you're a broker going from, that kind of environment started out as a trainee, put you through your cf1 and cf6, that's what they do generally, what they used to do you.
Speaker 1:Then you're getting leads through day in, day out. Generally you'll have a good diary, or if you're not, then you've got plenty of leads to bring yourself to. Then have a to try and convince to come and see you. And I think that because there's the that one, the one thing with any broker going self-employed, there's a lot of things, but the main thing is where am I going to get my leads from? Where am I going to get my business from? And a state agency, the corporate world, whether that's this is not just connell, this is like if you're unemployed with that in that world, they understand that that's your element of doubt. So they're going to pin, they're going to pin their hopes of retention and keeping you as a broker on the fact that where you're going to get your leads from oh, it's tough out there. Have you seen that they will all put that element of doubt and you're not 100% sure on your business model or your route to market or weight or all the things that you want to do.
Speaker 1:You'll then think, actually they are right. Yeah, I'm going to just be in this safe zone, I'm going to play it safe and not brave, of being self-advocate, and that's down to each individual in terms of making those decisions. You've obviously made a different one've, um, obviously made a different one, as I made a different one um, um, so several years ago. And luckily there are brokers that I know and work with and see that are thinking do you know what? We know that actually there are people I said that will stay and we'll have that loyalty and just do and be there. But then that broker that's got it in that, that little bit out there thinking is the motor, live, is there something that could? I do this myself? And, um, yeah, I've said quite plenty on that subject of being brave and just um, trusting yourself, trust your gut and scratch that itch this, but there's so much more.
Speaker 2:you can learn about your own industry as well, isn't there? Like I don't know about you, but when you came out of that world it was like I only know like 30% of what I should know. There's all 70% of stuff that I need to learn. I need meeting people, finding out that other brokers actually want you to succeed. You know the fact that there's people out there that will have a camaraderie with you, that will help you, that will work with you. I suppose, yeah, it's not a dog-eat-dog world. I think there's some great businesses out there that support one another Definitely.
Speaker 2:Not just from a Go on sorry, mate, Go on sorry, no, no I was just going to say just basically, just to know that you're not on your own, you know that you can pick up the phone to someone and just have a little bit of a chat about the latest struggle you're having because you're building your business or you're running something new. Um, you know I said there's a lot to learn, I think, but a lot of support out there if you, if you're willing to go out there and make yourself available.
Speaker 1:I suppose definitely Definitely, and it's a good point. Like I say, you don't know, you don't realise what the world of mortgage broker is like until you step out of that world. I think the other, so you learn a lot about being a broker. Like I say, you're probably right in terms of the 30% of it. I don't know about you, colin, but I think good to get your opinion on it.
Speaker 1:But I think for me, the biggest thing was learning so much about myself. I think that was the sort of the the biggest when I look back in terms of as an individual, as a sales manager, how I like, my values have always been the same and I've never stayed away from those and the people that I managed in that corporate world. I've not changed massively in terms of my interaction with people and how I manage. I don't really manage people now, but I put people in my business. But it's I learned. I've learned so much about myself and changed so much as a human being. Oh, it's eight years since I left the corporate world behind, just over eight years ago. I've learned so much about myself and like and I and it makes me smile in terms of thinking actually, yeah, you have changed and you have. You have developed as a human being that's, that's, that's huge, isn't it?
Speaker 2:I mean, I would say that just, uh, just from a working point of view, I mean from I, I wouldn't say I had a similar experience. I, I definitely had. Um, I know I have a moment, or had a moment of reflection when I left, because one of the things that I realized about myself, especially in that environment and it's probably one of the worst traits to have is I was a serial people pleaser, not to the people that worked for me, but to the people that are above me. I was always concerned Do they think I'm doing a good job? Are they happy with what I'm doing? And obviously, having that constant thought will only distract you from the job at hand, because you're not doing what you're meant to be doing. You're doing what you think somebody wants to see and often, sometimes, those things will intersect and you'll do exactly what you should be doing. But you know, depending on what your impressions are of yourself and others, it can have a negative effect too. So I suppose what I'm drawn down to is my own self-confidence and belief.
Speaker 2:I think it took me about a year and a half to two years to get to the point where I am now, after I left connells, I had a another job in between um with a. It was my first job at a small company. Um, I refer to it as small just purely because it was. I was employed directly by the owners. I'd never had that before and I reported to them. You know the, the brokerage has, I think, close to 20, 23 brokers, so it's really by no means small. But compared to where I came from, it was, and I would say I really struggled in that first year coming away from there.
Speaker 2:I think I was definitely still in that process of finding where I wanted to be and what I wanted to do and coming out of that environment, and I suppose what you were saying about finding yourself and being quite confident in yourself. I was going through that process whilst I was working for somebody else. Um, so not not there, I would say not the greatest experience for them, because they probably didn't get the best or what they hoped they would out of me, and I think, um that they're great guys both of them and I think they both agree with that um that they didn't really get out what they wanted. Neither did I, and we parted ways amicably, you know, and um moved on, but I suppose, again looking back, it led me to where I am now. So, whilst it was uncomfortable to go through, I'm pleased I did, because it started the cogs, thinking about where I wanted to be and what I wanted to do.
Speaker 1:So that's sort of good timing in terms of moving on, then from our talking about our it's been good conversation because I've enjoyed talking about so far, about sort of the corporate world. But then moving on to like you, in terms of like how you've developed, and talking about the mortgage broker knowledge and the exposure to the industry. So then you're like you've left the corporate world behind, you've done your little bits in between, and so what? So now where you're at now in terms of and how did this come about, in terms of what you're now doing?
Speaker 2:so my, my, I'll call it a gap. Yeah, my year that I spent at this company traveling.
Speaker 2:you know we're not talking about a gallery, no I wasn't travelling, my mind was gone, much to my dismay and theirs. I suppose it's a blip in my career that I wish I'd delivered more. I suppose that's what I'm probably trying to say, but anyway. So my time there, what I was doing was meeting with a lot of different people on behalf of this business, um, to to generate leads, essentially so like a business development role, and one of the things that was quite common that kept coming up was um, you know, I don't mind commission back. That's fine, that's great to receive something for sending a client, but what I'd really love is if I send you a client, if you could send me a client that's relevant to my business, so a sort of exchange. So that that was one idea, um, and then the other idea was getting into a, I suppose, an industry where I felt it's underserviced quite substantially, both from a client point of view, via their broker, and from a financial services point of view.
Speaker 2:I wouldn't say there's a go-to for any mortgage brokers out there, or IFAs oh yeah, I work with them or I work with them. There's people who do it, who you know. It's a service that's available, but it's not the primary function. So there's a, there's a stat that I picked up from the um, the will society, who were a member of this under under 50s, over 80 percent of them don't have a will. That's wow, huge number. And then when you drill that down to under 40s or under 35s, it gets closer to 90 to 95 percent um. And I suppose, when you think about the numbers, if I think about when I was in my 20s, my 30s, when I bought my first home, I didn't write a will um. I was a mortgage broker. It was until I bought my second home that I did my my first will um.
Speaker 2:And there's various different reasons why I'm sure that somebody doesn't have a will in place, whether it's financial, whether it's don't think I need it um, or that that maybe they've got that image of some like crusty old solicitor with a quill sat at a leather-bound desk that they have to go and have an interview with um and it's all really official and nobody's got a bloody clue what the language is. It's thou them, shall you know all that sort of stuff. And it's just it's so prohibitive, is that? Well, I can't be bothered, or it it could just be I've got nothing anyway. You know, they might think in their head. Well, I don't have any assets. You know I'm not a rich person and I suppose it couldn't be further from the truth. Is the importance to have it in place?
Speaker 1:Definitely, I think that's like you say.
Speaker 1:It's a good point in terms of where you've sort of come from and seen that exposure, seen that sort of especially from a, because what I really like is because you've come from that mortgage broker point of view, the mortgage broker space, and thought, actually there is a guy, and I think the point that you made, I think, is it tends to be knowledge of consequences, with people on the the whole will right and the state planning is that we don't.
Speaker 1:For me and you create me from wrong calling in terms of like your technique, because obviously you're far nearer to this, this industry, than than I am it seems to be that understanding of consequences with regards to, if something happened today to me as an individual, what are the what, what will happen and the consequence of not having something in place. So then, and that knock-on effect and yes, I may not be bothered because I might not be here and I might not but then actually do you care about the future, do you care what you leave behind? Do you care about where that sort of goes? So yeah, for me it always seems to be the knowledge of the consequences. That sort of seem to be the educational, the knowledge gap.
Speaker 2:I think that's where a lot of brokers can get tripped up because they start do you know what happens when you die? Do you know about the laws of intestacy? And it's like nobody wants to talk about that and I think the laws of intestacy, yes, obviously they're important to understand as a broker in terms of what happens and what goes where, because the more knowledge you have, the easier it is to explain to your client the ramifications of not having something in place. But I like to keep it really simple and to me there's two qualifying or three qualifying criteria if you really want to push it for having a will Are you alive, are you over the age of 18? And do you have an opinion? Oh, sorry, there's a fourth as well.
Speaker 2:Are you going to die? Die, and we all hit those. Most of us will hit all of that. Have an opinion. We're 18, be alive, I'm gonna die, it's gonna happen at some point and if you look at it really simply, a will just makes it really easy for the people you leave behind. It just greases the wheels, because the paperwork that's involved with somebody dying is massive and if it, if you've died without leaving instructions, it just gets more complicated, more longer, more drawn out, and then if you've taken advice from a mortgage broker and put life insurance in place, you've then got this massive asset. That you've got. You've left no instructions for who it's going to. You know, families plus money just usually equals carnage when there's no instructions. Yeah.
Speaker 1:And you've got no influence on the situation that's happening, that you've created really.
Speaker 2:No, not at all. I mean, obviously you can argue till the cows come home. Well, I'll be gone, it doesn't matter, but it must to a degree, because you've put life cover in place, so you've had the foresight to think well, I want to make sure that that person doesn't have that burden. Okay, cool, who's that person? All we need to do is put write that down and put that in a document. Um, and I suppose that's where the Will Place comes in, in terms of facilitating that and making it really simple and, I suppose, removing those barriers that I was talking about, because you can do it online. You can do it in 15 minutes, less than that, and it's not one of those WH Smith's DIY kits.
Speaker 2:You know that people sort of go on about being the worst thing in the world. Yes, you're putting the data in yourself, the system guides you through it, but we check every single one for you. We look at every single will that comes through our system and anything that's wrong we'll get in touch, and you can even ask us to speak to us as well. So if you're going through it and you go, oh, I don't know what I do here. There's a call me function. Give me a call. We'll give you a call within 24 hours and we'll just hi Colin from the Wheel Place, what's up, and you can run past any scenario you want and we'll guide you through it.
Speaker 1:So in terms of from a broker's point of view. So I'm thinking, obviously this is the, the main audience of the, the podcast. If I'm a broker, I'll identify opportunities for wills day in, day out. I will identify opportunities and 99 of the time I'll do nothing with it. I'll I'll identify the opportunity, I'll identify need and then just leave it there and I'll focus on the mortgage, I'll focus on the protection and I do understand that and I do get that. So, from a broker's point of view, how does the will place work for me and how does it benefit me as a broker?
Speaker 2:Why use it over anything else? Essentially, yeah, yeah benefit me as a broker.
Speaker 2:Why? Why use it over anything else? Essentially, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, it's so. That's the second part of what we've built um. That's why it, I suppose, appeals to brokers. So what we've built in there is not just a will writing tool for clients, but the system will also analyze all of the data that's put into it. It'll then highlight those risk areas to a client. So if there's shortfalls and to give you an example of those it could be the client's got multiple pensions, then we'll suggest a review with a financial advisor. If the client's got life insurance but it doesn't quite equal their mortgage balance, we'll suggest that they top it up. If it's not in trust, we'll suggest that they put the policy in trust. If they've got children, we'll give them an indicative price for family income benefit to help their guardians raise their kids. And all of these areas are then put to the client in a really simple way. The client is in the driving seat. They decide whether they want more information or not. If they want more, more information, then we just send it back to its source, which is you, the mortgage broker. So we don't take any of those, we don't do anything with them. They all come back to you.
Speaker 2:Um, there might be some people in the uh who watch this to think well, I service all my clients really, really well, and I'm sure you do that's. And if you pick up on every opportunity, well done, that's brilliant. But there may be clients who you, I suppose, make recommendations to, who may not be ready to hear that and may say no just because they're not in the headspace to make that decision. And our system could be a second chance. Just to highlight that in a different way. It could be that when you speak to the client on whatever product you arrange, especially if it's a longer-term product I know that's used for affordability sometimes it could be that their circumstances dramatically change and our system will keep in contact with that individual. So when their circumstances change, we regularly get in contact with them on a biannual basis to make sure that their will is still up to date. So if they have any children, that sort of thing, um, then their priorities and circumstances may change, so they may change their attitude towards life cover or to family income benefit. So, no matter where they are in that process, as soon as they decide that they want more information, you get a notification that the client would like to speak about life insurance or family income benefits. So it's a great way of, I suppose, capturing additional business from your existing client bank.
Speaker 2:But we take it a little step further. So all of your clients need to appoint an executor. So usually there's at least one executor or two on a will. Traditionally, an executor will be a brother, a sister, a close family friend, someone who is of a similar age to the person who's writing the will, and then the same thing for a guardian, again normally brother, sister or a close family friend. So we'll contact them on your behalf, we'll let them know that your client has written a will and then we'll offer them the your behalf. We'll let them know that your client has written a will and then we'll we'll offer them the ability to write a will through your system.
Speaker 2:Essentially that's linked to us. So you're getting new data from those guardians, from those executors, that you won't have in your crm at the moment and not in your client base, unless, obviously, that client's recommended them directly. They just so happen to buy at the same time. But I mean, if you haven't got that weird twist of fate where somebody just happens to be buying at exactly the same time, then our tool will give you that data. It gives you the client's name, data, address, email address, telephone number. So if they have a shortfall in a life cover on a mortgage that you didn't arrange, then that's far more valuable to you um than any revenue that you could get from a will.
Speaker 1:Now, and the reason why I'm talking about no revenue from a will is because the other way we get clients to do this is we have a model where we offer clients wills for free, so they don't pay anything at all, so there's no barrier for entry for that client to complete that will okay, so that, so that I'm understanding more about what sort of like the, the business model you have and the benefit which is the main thing to, which is another benefit as well, but the, the benefits the broker in terms of spotting opportunities, because we know what it's like as broker, you've been there, I've. Because we know what it's like as a broker You've been there, I've been there. We know what it's like when you're in that sort of the day-to-day of another lead coming in and another client to call and another follow-up and another case to progress. I think if you do maximise every single opportunity as a mortgage broker, you're in the top 1%. I said before, like 99% of brokers will not talk about every single thing financial advice, like you say, spotting about pensions and they're having three pensions in different places. Well, you need to be reviewing that and looking at putting them in one place generally. That's normally the thing that certainly needs to be reviewing it.
Speaker 1:And I think the four questions is good from that point of view of what you sort of talk about the over 18 and the rest of it. They're quick answers to go. Well, yes to everything. I do have an opinion, most people do have an opinion. So it's like well, you answered yes to all four. This is what we need to do and I think that from a broker point of view, just so I'm clear terms of so you can't we, you can offer as a broker, you could offer something. So I said, right, I work with the will place and I offer everything. One of my clients a free will. That's how we work. Yeah, absolutely so. That's how.
Speaker 2:Go on, sorry, go on, I you finish that we charge a firm essentially a very, very low monthly payment, which is fixed. It doesn't change. So your firm pays us a monthly subscription and in return you get a dual-branded link from us so you can have your logo sat next to ours and you can use that link with your existing clients to offer them a will that they don't have to pay for. Now I would encourage and I do encourage the people that work with us to avoid the word free, because sometimes it creates unnecessary barriers. So I would suggest, when you're talking to a client, that it's really simple, that you're buying an asset. As your advisor, I suggest that you put a will in place. We think it's so important that we've partnered with the will place and we cover the cost for you to put a will in place. So I'll send you the link for you to start writing your own will. But don't worry, because their advisors will check your document to make sure that it's legally valid and it'll be a full professional will at the end. That's not going to cost you anything other than 15 minutes.
Speaker 2:Um, and I think the other thing to come on to for mortgage brokers is a will fact find is exceptionally exposing.
Speaker 2:So if they don't do it with you, someone will suggest that they get a will in place.
Speaker 2:So if it's not you, it'll be someone else and in that fact find literally everything, because it's all about assets and liabilities, so not just about the loans that they have.
Speaker 2:It's about where their savings are, how much they have, what they've got invested, who it's managed by, um, what pensions they have, the value of those pensions, who they're with all of those things, things that a mortgage broker may not go into in as much detail or may not record all of those, all of that is exposed who their life covers with.
Speaker 2:So then you've then got a client that is potentially at risk of being referred somewhere else, depending on who that will writer works with, because they'll have referral partners. They will because that's where most will writers get their leads from financial advisors and other mortgage brokers. So if, if your client's being put in front of a will writer that you haven't introduced them to, then you've got a risk, essentially because if they even if that need isn't a service that you offer primarily as a business, like you may not do pensions. Quite a lot of mortgage brokers don't have a financial advisor within that brokerage, but I'm sure most of them know someone or could refer someone to them to make sure that that need is serviced within their business network I think that's it.
Speaker 1:It's overall protection of client as well. So forget the whole holistic advice, consumer duty and all the rest of it. It's about protecting your clients. So, like you say you are, I think the thing is what I've noticed with even though clients will open up to brokers, they always they will the good brokers. The client will open up, they'll feel like the friend and they will tell them a lot of information. I think with Will Wright I don't know what it is with Will Wright they do open up even more. Like I don't know why it is, it's just that's just a fact, like that is just fact that I've seen when they're going through the will, they just open up a little bit more. Because actually this is how it is. There's not the guard there thinking, well, the broker's going to try and sell me something, or I need to tell me the latest information as possible because I want to get this mortgage sorted out. And this is something that, whereas a will, you're not going to say yes or no, you're approved for your will. That's your will.
Speaker 1:It will, it is you would that that's your will, it's your choice, you already qualify.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're approved. So, um, yeah, exactly. So, yeah, I think one of the reasons behind that I think um is is because of where the questions go. So, um, I mentioned it earlier on that. Um, some people have the misconception that they have to have assets to have a will.
Speaker 2:But the most common gifts that I outline in a will for somebody that I'm writing are not financial. They have high emotional value. So it's about oh, that was my dad's ring. It's not worth anything financially if I melted it down, but I want my son to have it. Yeah, let's make sure he has it. Describe the ring and it's those sorts of things that they can put down into a document. And one of the hardest questions I have to ask is is about guardians who they want to raise their children if they're not there and then who they want to inherit if, if the horrible thing that most parents don't even want to consider if their kids pre-decease them. It's not a nice thing to talk about. Sometimes. You have to ask those questions so it becomes exceptionally emotive for some people. But you've got people in that headspace sharing, I suppose, thoughts about things that they wouldn't normally talk about that often. So I think that's probably why it's so exposing and why people open up so much.
Speaker 1:Good point. Yeah, it's a good point. I'm not thought it that way. So you've talked about from a broker aspect in terms of and we'll obviously at the end we'll put the links in the show to contact you and look at how to sort of have a bit more discussion about the world placing yourself. But we sort of talked briefly there about from a broker's point of view. But from a client's point of view, from a client's experience, what does that look like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so client obviously gets the link. They can use any device because it's URL-based. It's just a web browser. So whether it's a mobile, tablet or laptop, it's so simple for them to access and they can come back anytime so the system will save their progress as they go through. There's only five steps to go through. The first one is where you live your name, your date of birth, telephone number, contact details, that sort of thing. Second one is all about what you own, so your assets, assets basically where you live, if you've got any savings, where your pension is, who your life covers with, if it's in drugs, that sort of thing.
Speaker 2:Step three is about guardians. Now you can appoint guardians for your children, but also for your pets. So some people don't think about that. What happens to their dog? And some people it's a really high priority, depending on where that sits. So you could do that too. Then your executors mentioned that before. So they would just appoint who they want to administer their will. Now it should cover every single step.
Speaker 2:As the client goes through, they have a really brief explanation that tells them what each section's about, what they're filling in and who would be good for those particular roles. So if it's guardians or executors, we explain who would be good to fulfill those, and then the final step is just about gifts. If they want to make any gifts to any individuals and then divide in their estate, and then literally that's it, they're done. If you sat down and did it right now, you could fill it out in about 10 to 15 minutes. Because we don't take highly sensitive data. So we're not taking source codes, we're not taking account numbers. All we're taking is location and values. So, um, I I've got my savings with a post office. Um, I've got 500 pounds in that account. You know that sort of thing. Um, so once they've done that, the, the will is then put into something called a draft status, so it's all.
Speaker 2:Watermarked client can see their will immediately on their device, however they've accessed it so they can read through it and for a lot of people that might be the first time they've seen a will so they can see what the language is like. It's really plain, really simple, really straightforward, so they can check for spelling. If they want to go back in and think, actually I want to, I want to add another gift or I want to change that percentage of who I've allocated my stuff to slightly. They can do that straight away and then me, one of the team at the will place will check the will. So the things that we're looking for, we'll go through the find and make sure that what they've put in there matches their circumstances. And we'll also look at things like have they read the instructions? Because not everybody does so. Quite frequently we'll end up with a two-year-old executor, that sort of thing.
Speaker 2:So it's just it's saying right, right, so we need somebody who's 18 or over and we'll contact the client. Ideally, if we can speak to them, we will. If we can't get a hold of them, then we'll send an email just outlining why we want to speak to them and what changes they need to make. And then we'll unlock that, will remove the watermark and then give them signing instructions so that client can print it on any kind of paper they like. And then they've got full signing instructions from us and, as I said before, they can contact us at any time. So I suppose the great thing for the broker is they're removed from that process. It's not something that they have to get involved with. So they aren't going to get calls and say what I do here for me will. How do I do this? Because it's all there for the client, so yeah, okay makes sense.
Speaker 1:As I say, it's all about, I think, from a client point of view. If you're easing out the process and you're there at hand, like you said before, um, you've got that call button to sort of, then at least speak to somebody if you are struggling with that, that help and or the language or whatever, whatever case that the questions might be that come up. So, thank you, know that I'm getting a good picture from a broke point of view. Get a good picture from a from a client point of view. Um, and that sort of made and I think we didn't sort of in terms of where where's the world place going, in terms of, obviously we understand your past, we understand where you are now. Is any plans to develop, change or enhance or anything like that?
Speaker 2:so we all know the tech for the world place. Everything that we have, we've built in-house, so our main goal is to just make our system more intuitive, better at what it does. So every quarter we bring updates to the platform. So currently we operate in england and wales. By the end of the quarter, we'll also operate in scotland. By the end of the year we'll also operate in northern ireland. Now the reason why we're not in scotland and northern ireland is they have slightly different legal jurisdictions and slightly different formats for their wills, so that it needs to be adjusted and it needs to be slightly different in terms of the questions that we ask.
Speaker 2:Lasting power of attorney is, then, the other missing piece, I feel, because I think arguably that's more important than a will having a lasting power of attorney in place, and we'll be adding that onto our system, and the idea behind that is not only can we make sure that a client understands the need for a lasting power of attorney and why somebody under the age of 50 would think it's a good idea, but also we think we can generate leads for income protection and critical illness from our risk assessment back to our mortgage brokers for that too. So we have two clients really in mind. We have our business clients, who are our brokers, and our IFAs, who use our platform and we want to make sure that they are serviced well. And then we've also got our end user, our actual client, who writes a will on the platform. So we want to make sure that they understand the need and why they might want income protection and critical illness and how that pairs up with a lasting power of attorney.
Speaker 2:And the real simple explanation is you guys take care of the financial, but remember we've got that GDPR thing in the background. You know that thing that kind of stops anybody talking to you about anything. If you imagine you've got an individual critical illness policy, your client can't phone your insurer, then how do they claim? So that's where the lasting power of attorney can come in and be really helpful and marry up with it. It can help navigate those areas. May just be that they don't want to deal with it, so they can delegate that authority to somebody else to deal with it on their behalf and an lpa just really deals with the legal, while the the insurance policy will deal with the financial absolutely that's a good point.
Speaker 1:It's a good point. So just to I think, just to wrap things up, colin, from a, from a, overlooking the overall, looking at our industry and looking at what brokers do day to day. It benefits the brokers for two things it's because it's enhancing the client experience with that broker. It's also protecting their sales and the retention of that client, which is a big thing for me in terms of that. If they then go on Google and look for a will writer locally and then all of a sudden they referred to another, somebody else about the protection and somebody else, and then all of a sudden they're then about the pension and then all of a sudden that IFA is getting into the protection and getting to the mortgage and then you've lost the client and that's so. Then for no real, you've not done anything wrong, you've just not maximized the opportunity and with that with that particular client.
Speaker 1:So it benefits the broker of referring to somebody that they know and trust. They're going to get a branded thing that looks like it's part of them. It's offering a benefit to their service as well. So if they are charging a broker fee and sort of saying you are, you're going to get a will sorted out at our cost as part of that deal. That's another sort of way to look at it and also as well so benefits the broker for client retention. It obviously helps them spot opportunities that they may have missed and sort of then can look at how they can enhance their process with that as well, and then it also benefits their clients. So from a which is more likely to win on referrals, more likely to win on five-star reviews and all those kind of things, so the whole client journey is looked after by referring to and working with somebody like yourself.
Speaker 2:So, um, yeah, it's been, uh, yeah that that and the added bonus that the leads we send back to you from a revenue point of view would be much higher than what you would do from a standard will referral yeah, absolutely definitely, pauline.
Speaker 1:Hopefully pod first podcast, as in the world right in place was it wasn't too uh, too bad. We've sort of gone on for sort of over 45 minutes, so um, so yeah, it wasn't. Hopefully wasn't too bad and quite a pleasant first experience I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 2:I think at some point you might be worried if I was going to come up for air, but I am. No, it's good no, it's been.
Speaker 1:It's been great chatting, like really appreciate your time to come on. Obviously we wanted to. I wanted to talk about the world place and what you're doing there so people are interested. We'll put the links in the, the show notes about how to reach out to. You can fact like calling girl on linkedin. They can find you on there and obviously you've got links to your website and things like that on there as well. So people should find it easy enough to to find you and to to to reach out.
Speaker 1:And, yeah, really enjoyed our conversation. It was good to talk about what you watched. I didn't expect to get out was more. It was a little bit about past and journey into the self-employed world and your honesty as well in terms of what that looked like initially and where you are now, and it's just been great to chat. So I really appreciate your time. Colin, thanks for coming on. Thank you very much. Thanks for that, colin. Thanks for agreeing to come on the podcast, obviously first experience or the podcast from and being at the world place. So I really appreciate your time. Gave a good account, totally understand what you're offering in terms of the benefits from a broker point of view and a client point of view as well. So I really appreciate your time and thanks for coming on.
Speaker 1:An interesting reminder the Foundations of Freedom webinar Jonathan Needham and I next one is Wednesday, the 4th of September. So if you email events at thebrokerfoundercom, if you email events at thebrokerfoundercom, we'll send you the link. And yeah, just if you think about going self-employed as a broker or very early in that journey as well, I think you'll benefit from attending the webinar and listening to what Jonathan and I have got to say. And, as always, if you found today's episode useful, please don't forget to follow the podcast. Leave a review. We share it with other brokers or business owners that you might feel will benefit from the podcast.
Speaker 1:And if you are thinking about becoming a self-employed mortgage broker, or you're looking to start your own business as a mortgage broker, or you're looking to grow and scale your existing business, go to my website, craigskeletoncouk. Book a discovery call, send me whatsapp. Whatever the case may be, let's just have a chat about how I can help you achieve your goals for the rest of 2025 and for long term as well. And, as always, please don't forget to run your own race.